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 Post subject: Your feelings on formalities?
PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2017 2:45 pm 
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A question about being addressed as "Ma'am" (or, if you're a gentleman, "Sir")

I grew up in a world in which the word "Ma'am" was used for people that you didn't know well, and with whom you were being VERY formal. For instance, a police officer, the principal of your school, the person who waited on you at McDonalds, a military superior.

When I was 11, I transferred to a Fundamentalist Baptist school, in which the words Ma'am and Sir were de rigeur - many students even addressed their parents as "Ma'am" and "Sir." This seemed shocking to me, and distant rather than warm and loving. I didn't mind addressing teachers that way - but for parents, it just seemed WRONG.

Fast forward to now. I don't LIKE to be addressed as Ma'am by younger friends (say, 20-somethings). If you're waiting on me at McDonalds, yes - but at Church coffee hour no.

OTOH, I have a friend from the deep South who is offended if young people don't address her as Ma'am - even in her own family. I guess that's her cultural background.

Soooo - what are YOUR feelings on this cultural tradition?

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 Post subject: Re: Your feelings on formalities?
PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2017 4:09 pm 
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Anna1111 wrote:
A question about being addressed as "Ma'am" (or, if you're a gentleman, "Sir")

I grew up in a world in which the word "Ma'am" was used for people that you didn't know well, and with whom you were being VERY formal. For instance, a police officer, the principal of your school, the person who waited on you at McDonalds, a military superior.

When I was 11, I transferred to a Fundamentalist Baptist school, in which the words Ma'am and Sir were de rigeur - many students even addressed their parents as "Ma'am" and "Sir." This seemed shocking to me, and distant rather than warm and loving. I didn't mind addressing teachers that way - but for parents, it just seemed WRONG.

Fast forward to now. I don't LIKE to be addressed as Ma'am by younger friends (say, 20-somethings). If you're waiting on me at McDonalds, yes - but at Church coffee hour no.

OTOH, I have a friend from the deep South who is offended if young people don't address her as Ma'am - even in her own family. I guess that's her cultural background.

Soooo - what are YOUR feelings on this cultural tradition?


I feel about the same as you. *I* even say ma'am or sir when i am waiting on people at the bank as i am their "servant". I was raised in CA where i never remember hearing it or being told to address anyone in that manner. Throughout the years i have been exposed to the various ways but i don't really care if someone addresses me that way or not. There seems to be a proper time to say it - as when you are showing submission, i guess. ???

OTOH, *I* don't care if someone addresses me as "honey", either! :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Your feelings on formalities?
PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2017 7:23 pm 
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Location: Central TX
I rarely heard "ma'am" or "sir" until I joined the military. Then, I had to say it all the time, and it really annoyed me because it felt so fake and forced. Now that I live in the south, I hear it a lot. I get called "ma'am" and "hon" by many people, male and female, young and old. I don't mind it, I rather like it. The young guy with a dyed mohawk, piercings, and tattooes, that checks/bags our grocieries, calls every woman "hon" or "honey". I think it's sweet. I usually only say "ma'am" or "sir" if I don't know the person's name and I need to get their attention.

I never understood saying it to your family, though. Like making your kid call you "ma'am". That would feel really weird.

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 Post subject: Re: Your feelings on formalities?
PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2017 7:43 pm 
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Deep south here.. A child is taught "yes ma'am" "no, sir" from birth.
My children are grown and I still insist on it from them. It's a sign of respect here.
Like giving up a seat for someone or holding a door open just to be polite... Sir and ma'am are a sign of a good up- bringing. If you say them, people know "your mama raised you right."


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 Post subject: Re: Your feelings on formalities?
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2017 12:48 pm 
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Maybe it's because Lisa & I are both vets that we both see it as "fake"

I see respect as something earned, not demanded. (DISrespect is another matter!)

When I was in the military, we had to call all officers "Ma'am" or "Sir." But, sometimes someone would forget. The officers who were offended when someone slipped were invariably a little narcissistic. Those who were gracious about it were the ones that I *actually* respected the most (rather than just being forced to fake respect). We had many officers that I didn't respect *at all* - but I still called them "Ma'am" or "Sir" - by force (like the guy who ran the br0t*hel in his time off, or the guy who brought p0*rn into the office to show everyone).

OTOH, I'm pretty sure my Mom would have been offended if I called her "Ma'am" - ask if I was holding her at arm's length. And she's the one I respected most in the whole world!

On a similar note, I grew up saying the Lord's Prayer with Elizabethan English - calling God "Thou" I was very surprised to notice one day (after years of saying it!) that the Lord's Prayer in the Original Greek addresses *God* in the familiar/informal form! Because although we *respect* God more than anyone, he's still "Daddy!"

I can't imagine addressing my DH as "Sir" on a regular basis - even tho I respect him greatly.

Anyone on here address their DH (current or late) as "Sir" routinely?

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 Post subject: Re: Your feelings on formalities?
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2017 3:52 pm 
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Children are taught to respect. How do they know what it is if it's not taught?

Children probably feel "forced" to do lots of things, but adults make them do it to teach them.

A mother teaching her child respect is very different than a drill sergeant in the military.. I'd hope so anyway.


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 Post subject: Re: Your feelings on formalities?
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2017 4:14 pm 
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Yes, with children, of course - to some extent.

But, I don't tell dd "You WILL respect me!" I do forbid disrespect, and teach HOW to show respect - then leave the rest up to her.

I guess that I have trouble with the idea of respect - like love - that's forced rather than freely given - and certainly not an occasion for offense. Then how does someone AUTHENTICALLY show respect or love if they're forced to demonstrate what they don't believe or feel? (as the case of the military officers I knew?)

And, I guess from my cultural perspective, "Ma'am" and "Sir" just seem cold.

My military drill sergeant was a wonderful woman, btw - quite worthy of the title Ma'am - and in a situation where it DID seem appropriate.

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 Post subject: Re: Your feelings on formalities?
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2017 6:52 pm 
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There are different kinds of respect, aren't there? The Bible tells us to "reverence", also translated respect, our husbands. It certainly doesn't say "when he deserves it". And there is respecting a position someone is in, like the President, whether or not we agree with them. I think respect for elders and positions generally require us to put aside our judgment of the person.

???


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 Post subject: Re: Your feelings on formalities?
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2017 7:02 pm 
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I understand your point, Sis - that's what the military always told us, too! You respect the rank, not the person.

But, at some point, I see it as a false dichotomy. I see (not saying I'm necessarily RIGHT ; ) that our husbands by definition DESERVE our respect. And, our parents, by definition deserve our honor & obedience. Even on their bad days : )

I definitely agree that King David did the right thing to respect King Saul - even when he was very sinful!

But, I see a big difference between "Wives, respect your husbands" and (the nonexistent command that is often perceived ; ) "Husbands, force your wives to show you respect"

But, if "Sir" means respect even with familiarity, why have I almost never heard a lady address her husband as "Sir?" Even if she's in the Church & believes in submission in the strictest interpretation?

On a personal note, I'd rather hear DD call me "Mommy" once than call me "Ma'am" 100 times. It just seems SO much more warm & loving : )

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 Post subject: Re: Your feelings on formalities?
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2017 8:08 pm 
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Lol! My kids don't call me ma'am... They call me mom.
Ma'am is used in other various ways that I'm not going to get into explaining.
It's a cultural thing. I'm sure there are things in other cultures that I don't understand or agree with, either.

My dc have a good friend that does address me as ma'am. But its a formality and showing me upmost respect. I am not offended in the least, because obviously she was brought up properly in our southern ways. She could call me "Mrs. Soandso" but SHE chooses to call me ma'am.


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