Most ARE NOT "dying". And I agree with the sentiment, however, if they weren't here it wouldn't be a problem. Right?

(I don't get the winky comment?)

If *I* weren't here, I wouldn't be a problem, either.

I think seeing human beings as "problems" for being human - or for being impoverished - is a *problem* for Christians. Remember that the Bible tells us we must love the alien and treat him as one of our own (http://biblehub.com/leviticus/19-34.htm)

Now, if they commit crimes (some do) or attack, try to subvert or terrorize our Christian culture (some do) I see *that* as a problem. But, I also see that as a problem when citizens do it.

And, as mentioned before in passing, I am deeply disturbed that those who are willing to break our laws get in, while those who are very well qualified and wait for legal channels and immigration lotteries are so often refused.

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>>>Remember that the Bible tells us we must love the alien and treat him as one of our own (http://biblehub.com/leviticus/19-34.htm)



>>>1 Timothy 5:8
Anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.

>>>I think seeing human beings as "problems" for being human - or for being impoverished - is a *problem* for Christians. Remember that the Bible tells us we must love the alien and treat him as one of our own (http://biblehub.com/leviticus/19-34.htm)
<<<I don't want to see people as problems. But I do see people that take cuts in lines, lie, cheat, steal, as problematic and by definition all illegals have done that.

Granted - and some folks do so quite maliciously. (For instance, the drug cartels)

*But* many third world families are quite literally watching their children starve in front of them. I've lived in the third world (more than one location) and I've seen it. I cannot honestly find fault with someone who breaks a rather arbitrary law to save the lives of their children.

ETA: The law differentiates between crimes that are "Malum in se" - morally wrong like murder and theft, and "Malum Prohibitum" - wrong because they're against the law - for instance, not registering your dog. They are quite different matters. I believe for many immigrant families the issue is "Malum Prohibitum"

Before I lived in the third world, I would have taken a much harsher perspective on these things. But, having seen the great want there, and the great excess here, I cannot begrudge someone the ability to come here and work 15 hour days at heavy labor - as some do - to feed their children.

I think 1 Tim 5:8 underlines Leviticus 19:34. (I'm guessing that's what you were intending) if we love the alien and treat the alien as one of our own, we are not willing to watch him starve or go without medical care.

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>>>I think 1 Tim 5:8 underlines Leviticus 19:34. (I'm guessing that's what you were intending) if we love the alien and treat the alien as one of our own, we are not willing to watch him starve or go without medical care.

<<< I had to leave so didn't really get to finish my tho't there. I wanted to add "One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you." Ex 12:49.

IMHO, As long as they are ABIDING by the law they are to be treated as one of our own. I guess I feel a bit "Hebrew-ish" in the sense that, if you want to live freely here, you need to abide by our laws. ??

Anna, I may sound like I'm hard-hearted. I'm really not. It's one thing to say how things *should* be and quite another to carry it out. I have become more cynical thru the years. I've seen more people cheat their way, and often for good reason but more often not, to get more than is right or have to pay less than is owed. I find that most people are more than happy to bend over backwards to help others whenever possible when they know there is a real need. Sadly, too many times the people that are helped are better off than the ones giving til it hurts.



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No, I don't think you're hard-hearted, Sis. I've chatted with you a long time on here, and I'm pretty sure that if you have a neighbor you can see who is in need, you'd be among the first to give.

I do think that many Americans have never seen the kind of poverty that exists abroad, and it's easy to assume that someone is taking advantage when really they're in desperate need. It's easy to assume that the run-down American trailer park is poverty. But, they're are folks in the rest of the world who'd do *anything* to live in such comparative luxury.

I agree that abiding by the law is very important. Personally, I tend to set my cruise control at or below the speed limit routinely. But, laws are not always just. A law that says "We want to keep all of our excess for ourselves, to the point of hurting our own health by overeating, and letting the excess rot before we share it" is a law that I can understand someone else breaking when their kids are starving. Think of how many starving people that one night's trash at the local buffet would save from death. I don't blame those folks if they come (illegally) to feed that "trash" to their children.

I did have law abiding friends abroad who waited their turn to immigrate - and some I suppose never got the chance - while I watched the folks that I *knew* to be dishonest jump the line and illegally immigrate. so I DO see your point on that. But, until we free up our immigration laws so that those who are in need and willing to work are welcome, I don't expect it to improve.

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