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 Post subject: Looking for your input...
PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2012 12:03 pm 
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Once upon a time, this board was created because a group of the participants here wanted to study C.S. Lewis's The Screwtape Letters together. This was a board where people tried to come together with what we have in common -- to celebrate our Risen Lord, to reflect on God's presence in our daily lives, and to dig a little deeper into Scripture so our walks would be more solid. C.S.Lewis described Christianity as a hallway with many doors, each representing a different way to become close to the Lord. We tried to focus on the hallway rather than the rooms behind the doors. This is a board that has led more than one person to Christ.

Way back when I was a frequent visitor to another site where squabbles among the Christians were frequent regarding the differences between denominations, Scripture interpretations, church structure/leadership, etc. In order for me to get a better understanding of where each faction was coming from, I ended up buying a book called Handbook of Denominations. Dh and I referred to it as my "play book." What happened with that board? Once I learned about the different perspectives, it ceased to be interesting. Rather, the constant bickering led me to scratch my head about why everyone couldn't get along since we all have the same foundation even though the houses built above that foundation each look different. I haven't been to that board in years. What do you suppose a non-Christian would have thought if he dropped into the board to see that?

So how can we get back to the original purpose of this board? We cannot continue as we are now. Please share your ideas. Thanks.

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 Post subject: Re: Looking for your input...
PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2012 12:45 pm 
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I think it'd probably be a good idea to not focus on denominational differences, because that tends to cause people to get upset.
If someone believes a particular denominational way in thought or practice they are going to slant their opinions/thoughts/ideals in that direction, which can be good or bad. But it's always bad when another person is made to feel inferiour because of what they believe or think. Instead if someone chooses to put their denomination perferences into a confersation, they should imo at the beginning state something along the lines of "according to what I personally believe based on my understanding of scriptures I believe..." or "because I am (blank) I tend to believe or I am convicted that this (blank) is true or false.
Differences can be shared and the person who believes one way should be able to state what and why they believe something, but at the same time another person who believes differently should be allowed to say so and why without being derogatory, mean or offensive.
For example I have relatives who are involved in a lot of things I disagree with, everything from Mormonism to Paganism to lots of other things. On some topics it is best that we just agree to disagree, I've already told them what I believe and why, they don't at the moment see where what they believe is wrong, *I'm sorry but I do personally believe certain things are contradictory to scripture and therefore I disagree with them, and I can't reasonably agree to agree differently, instead I just agree to disagree with them, I believe I'm right they're wrong, and they believe the same thing only in reverses, lol.

What I think that would be good here in my personal opinion though would be to look for common ground things that are positive that can be compatable with most if not all denominations. Things such as how we treat others, and why it is a good testimony to always offer kindness instead of mean spiritedness or ill will towards others.
What we have personally found helpful in our own lives as far as spiritual growth, and why we believe we've grown spiritually.
How Proverbs 31 applies to todays ladies, how time management is biblical and what we've found to help us in our own lives with that.
How hospitality is something every Christian should practice, ways to show hospitality with limited resources.

Why a Christian should never complain of being poor when they have all of Heaven to look forward to, money, wealth and riches don't all mean the same thing. (Well techically they do, but not really, you can have money, but be poor spiritually, fellowship wise, or you can be financially deficient but wealthy in love, friends, children, happiness, joy, peace, comfort, knowledge (skills))

I think a Bible study board can be a very good thing, but it can also be something to cause strife if anyone wants to push what they personally believe to be true over what everyone else does. If someone wants to go into a deeper discussion that goes along denominational doctrines, traditions or anything like that it might be better to do that privately or state at the beginning that is what is intended so that someone who has made up their mind differently can either read the topic and learn what someone else believes and maybe state why they disagree, but then just let it go so the other party can discuss for those interested why they believe as they do.

I hope all of that makes sense.

I like to read through the Bible study section here sometimes but I don't really comment a lot, because as you can see I already type too much, lol.

I personally have very strong believes about certain things, and I know that there are others here who believe differently, so I just with myself agree to disagree on those topics.

There is one thing though I do personally believe and this is not meant to be offensive to anyone, but I personally believe that any church or denomination that claims to be Christian should always know or have a reasonable way of finding out, that those they place as leaders for Sunday school classes or other teaching positions within the church should always be in agreement with that church or denomination.

The reason why is because I had a relative who believed she could walk both sides of the fence comfortably, (because she was made to feel at home and comfortable in the church that she attended, she continued to practice things that went completely against any type of Christian church or organization, which is in my personal opinion a very bad mark against that particular denomination and or church she attended, because I personally believe she may have literally died unsaved, and that bothers me tremendously. I know I have no way of knowing if she was really saved of not, but I find it very unlikely based on what I knew of her and her life.)

I don't believe any church of any denomination that claims to believe in Jesus Christ should be so accepting of someones sin, that the person never sees a reason to turn from their sin so that they can be saved. I am also not saying any church/denomination should reject anyone, but the whole object of the church is to win people to Christ so they can go to Heaven, and not spend an eternity in Hell, when a church basically conforms to the world to the point being there is no conviction, and no difference between the church, and the world, then there is really no reason for that particular organization to even claim to be Christian, they may as well be a "social club" because at least then they are not pretending to be something they are not, which in turn leads someone to be so comfortable in their own sins, that they die in those sins, and then proceed directly to an eternity in Hell.

*And again, I didn't say the above to be offensive to anyone, it is just something that really bothers me because of what I saw happen, and it could have literally have been any church or denomination, it just happened to be the one my aunt was associated with up until her death. To me that is a huge stumbling block.

Another thing I've seen that is a huge stumbling block to the lost comes from within the denomination that I belong to, and that was what happened to us last year, that was when we were asked to leave the church we'd been attending for a number of years. There was no biblical reason for this, even the pastor stated as much. However, although what happened there was meant to be hurtful towards our family (in my personal opinion) God used to bless us tremendously, in many different ways, not quickly and not yet fully, but God has blessed us. God provided housing when we had no resources whatsoever, God provided transportation, and God provided my husband with a job, and my dh health has been improving.

Anyway, I'm going to get off topic if I keep typing so I'll stop, I do think a Bible study board can be a good way for people to talk about what they believe and why, and about how they came to accept Christ, and how God has been working in their lives etc.

Some topics however people are not going to agree on, things like
assurance of salvation (some denominations believe you can lose your salvation)
speaking in tongues (some denominations believe that is for today, some believe it stopped after the Bible was complete)
baptism of the dead (some denominations believe you are supposed to do this some have no idea what I'm talking about, lol)
infant baptism,
prayers to saints, or to God alone
and so on and on the list can go...

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[i][i]Psalms 28:7
The LORD is my strength and my shield; my heart trusted in him, and I am helped: therefore my heart greatly rejoiceth; and with my song will I praise him.
[/i][/i]


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 Post subject: Re: Looking for your input...
PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2012 1:01 pm 
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I think it might be best to have a rule to discuss what is GOOD about our OWN beliefs and not what is BAD about (what we perceive as) the beliefs of others.

This last issue began, IMHO, when a few of us said something GOOD about our own Faith, and we (or at least I) felt that others were not only criticizing our Faith, but inaccurately so.

Keeping our discussion to ME instead of YOU might help.

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 Post subject: My input
PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2012 1:20 pm 
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Location: Sunshine State
Martha: "Once upon a time, this board was created because a group of the participants here wanted to study C.S. Lewis's <i>The Screwtape Letters</i> together. This was a board where people tried to come together with what we have in common -- to celebrate our Risen Lord, to reflect on God's presence in our daily lives, and to dig a little deeper into Scripture so our walks would be more solid."

Me: Yes. If one has a different viewpoint one should just consider what has been posted and pray about it. One can choose to reject or accept it. I posted the video because it was exactly what Martha states above...two Christians from different denominations having a pleasant conversation. What I was hoping to happen here.

Martha: "Way back when I was a frequent visitor to another site where squabbles among the Christians were frequent regarding the differences between denominations, Scripture interpretations, church structure/leadership, etc....

...the constant bickering led me to scratch my head about why everyone couldn't get along since we all have the same foundation even though the houses built above that foundation each look different....

...So how can we get back to the original purpose of this board? We cannot continue as we are now. Please share your ideas. Thanks."

Me: I do feel with those here who have felt like their beliefs were belittled. I am a Christian, because I believe in and follow Christ. To constantly have one's beliefs questioned or challenged to come up with 'proof texts' to 'back up' their beliefs is not edifying the body of Christ, its divisive. If you dont agree that I should shave my head bald, just stay silent. I am not asking you to shave your head or agree with me for my decision to shave my head.

So I would institute the silence rule, if you dont agree with someone else's beliefs, stay silent and dont challenge or belittle. Every Christian sets off on a journey, we start out as babes, needing simple things as we mature we gain more understanding as the Holy Spirit guides us. We are not all on the same page, we will all hopefully be in heaven someday.

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 Post subject: Re: Looking for your input...
PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2012 1:36 pm 
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Anna1111 wrote:
I think it might be best to have a rule to discuss what is GOOD about our OWN beliefs and not what is BAD about (what we perceive as) the beliefs of others.

This last issue began, IMHO, when a few of us said something GOOD about our own Faith, and we (or at least I) felt that others were not only criticizing our Faith, but inaccurately so.

Keeping our discussion to ME instead of YOU might help.



I'm not sure if I saw the discussion you've made mention to, but I do think it's a good idea to try to remember to look for the good things and not the bad.
However, I do believe that if someone would like to know if something is true or not true about a different denomination, that it does not hurt to ask in a nice way, such as "is it true that your denomination or church believes (blank)" or "as I've been studying various cultures, religions, teachings etc. I've read several accounts that state your denomination believes this (blank) is this true or accurate? What are reliable sources to read to find out and why. "

The reason I think that it is helpful to ask about the different things people believe is because there are many people from all denominations who really don't know what their own churches believe doctrinally, and why they believe as they do, when someone has to give an answer as to "why" they believe as they do then they are reaffirming that for themselves or they have to ask themselves exactly "why" it is they are saying they agree with something when they don't fully comprehend exactly what it is they are saying they are in agreement with.

It is also biblical to always be ready to give an answer to other as to what you believe. It's not enough to say that you believe something because your parents, pastor, friends, relatives, neighbors etc believe something, you personally need to know what you believe and for why you believe what you do.

Atheist have been known to come to Christ when they've had to give reasons for why they do not believe Christ, or when they have taken the time to search out for themselves why they believe as they do. (They believe there is no God, but when they have searched the matter out for themselves many times they have changed their minds)

Also another thing is when someone is involved in a cult, if presented with the truths of scripture that individual will at some point see the errors of that cult, and turn from it. But if the person who is trapped by false doctrines or a cult is never questioned as to what they believe and for why they believe as they do, then they build their beliefs and faith on traditions, and the ideals of men, which will fail, when if presented with scripture they can then freely choose whether to accept the scriptures or reject them. It is because of lack of knowledge that people are oppressed, or held captive in traditions of no lasting eternal value.

God wants us to seek after wisdom, understanding and knowledge, he doesn't want us to be ignorant, he also wants us to be able to clearly state what we believe and why.

When we can give a clear presentation of the gospel we are more able to win others for Christ so they can spend eternity in Heaven or they can openly and freely choose to go to Hell, but when they make that choice our hands are clean, because we have presented to them to the best of our ability the way to Heaven.

If we can't tell someone what we believe and why, when it comes to the gospel of Christ, we may be one of the biggest stumbling blocks to come into the lives of a person who may really want to know if there is any merit to what those who are Christian say.

I mean think about it, when we tell someone we believe something because so and so believes something, we've not made a case for our belief, we've stated we have faith in that person, but we've not stated why and we've laid no foundation for why anyone should change what they believe to be true to what we say we know to be true.

The gospel needs to be presented to others as clearly as we know how, and we need also to know why we believe, because when we can't really give a good reason calmly, what we say we believe may appear to have less value than the pagan that calmly states they believe all ways lead to Heaven, or states any of their other beliefs.

Remember that whenever we are offended, it may not be intentional, and "a soft answer turns away wrath", :) I don't really believe anyone on this board purposely wants to offend anyone, but sometimes we can become offended when someone says something in a way that makes us question ourselves, and we can't give a reasonable answer to ourself, so instead of looking for why someone says something we may sometimes go on the defensive when there was no offense ever intended.

I hope that all makes sense. :)

And we are supposed to focus as much as possible on things that are good, focusing on the bad things in life just make for discontent and stress, and its not healthy. Just my personal opinion of the matter. :)

_________________
[i][i]Psalms 28:7
The LORD is my strength and my shield; my heart trusted in him, and I am helped: therefore my heart greatly rejoiceth; and with my song will I praise him.
[/i][/i]


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 Post subject: Re: Looking for your input...
PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2012 1:39 pm 
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" If you dont agree that I should shave my head bald, just stay silent. I am not asking you to shave your head or agree with me for my decision to shave my head."

At the rate my hair is falling out, I feel like I'm going bald, lol (I thought this particular statement was funny because of that, lol) and I hope the rest of my hair doesn't fall out.

_________________
[i][i]Psalms 28:7
The LORD is my strength and my shield; my heart trusted in him, and I am helped: therefore my heart greatly rejoiceth; and with my song will I praise him.
[/i][/i]


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 Post subject: Re: Looking for your input...
PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2012 2:41 pm 
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Before I read thru the comments so far, I have an idea. Martha, what do you think about a Hot Topics board? It could be closed so non-Christians couldn't stumble on it and those who wished to avoid the high blood pressure ;) could easily avoid it.

A thread that became hot could be moved to that board as well. :?:


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 Post subject: Re: Looking for your input...
PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2012 2:58 pm 
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The gist of my thoughts is that there's not really been an issue. I don't really think things need to change, although I like the idea Briva mentioned (something I'd said the other day as well). Don't jump in to a conversation just to state your disagreement and continuously challenge people and try to prove them wrong. Accept that people are on their journeys, that God is big enough to handle it all Himself, and respect that some people disagree with you. I need to remember this too! I realize that.

I don't love Sis' idea (sorry, Sis!). I wouldn't go there, partly because I don't think just talking about my faith in a natural way is a "hot topic." Here, we talk about our real lives and our real faith. Orthodoxy is my framework. It's going to come out as we share our lives together. I need to continue to have the freedom to speak from the realities of my faith. If people wonder things, I don't mind answering questions. If people disagree, I can even handle that. What I won't do is go down to minute detail and play Scripture wars with people. No good can come from that and I've already seen that people can interpret Scriptures different ways. I don't believe I do that to others; forgive me if I have.

This doesn't just go one way. For example, I have a real problem with reformed theology, Scripturally, but I'm not going to ask someone who's reformed to prove their beliefs. Oh, I think it's also good to realize that we could have some Catholics come here some day, we could have some Mormons (who consider themselves Christian), we could have some Jehovah's witnesses, SDA, Messianic, etc. We probably do have some Pentecostals and Word of Faith people, and I know we have some Baptists, Lutherans, Methodists, non-denominational, home-churching, etc. Christians. All types of Christianity, all these and others, have parts to them that some people will question.

I think it's important to take into consideration that a handful or more people at this board have became Orthodox (or are looking in to it). I began taking a serious look at Orthodoxy after DebD, who used to post here at HSC asked just one little question of me. That was the spark that changed my walk of faith completely. The freedom we have to post about what we live and believe is vital, I think, to this board.
_____________
Side note: Martha, can you consider the suggestion to rename the board? We don't really do "Bible study" here. We talk about our faith, which includes but is not limited to, the Bible. We also talk about prayer, church, approaches to holidays, loving people, etc. AND the Bible.

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Last edited by Darla on Wed Oct 31, 2012 6:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Looking for your input...
PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2012 3:45 pm 
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Puh! Well, *I* don't love *your* idea either! :P {Said in an overly childish pout!}

But, seriously, I see the things YOU are talking about as belonging as much on the HSC friends board. I do try to take my scriptural questions/thoughts to the Bible Study board but often will post them on the HSC Friends board, too, just cuz it's more trafickized. (That ought to be a word.)

So, does anything really need to change then? I tho't the hot topic board for threads management would like to freeze as well as for topics that seem bound for heat like.... Christmas! ;-)


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 Post subject: Re: Looking for your input...
PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2012 5:45 pm 
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Quote:
God wants us to seek after wisdom, understanding and knowledge, he doesn't want us to be ignorant, he also wants us to be able to clearly state what we believe and why.


I agree with this somewhat, but I have known simple minded people and children fall into this category, too (I used to work with developmentally disabled adults) and I know that they can clearly state to me the truth of the gospel without having to quote Scripture or know the intricacies of their faith... :)

I like Darla's idea of renaming the board, maybe FaithWalk or something along those lines?

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